06/18/2012-CC-Minutes-JointMINUTES:SPECIAL CALLED JOINT MEETING WITH CITY COUNCIL, PARKS
BOARD AND 4B DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION
June 18, 2012
PRESENT:Mayor Thomas Muir,Councilmember Marjory Johnson,Councilmember
Russell Martin,Councilmember Scott Stephens, Councilmember Gary
Bilyeu,Councilmember Rusty Patton, 4B Member Barbara Martin, 4B
Member, Beverly Howard, Park Board Member, Chris Byrom, Park Board
Member Bob Koger, and Park Board Member Mendy Echols
ABSENT:Tami Taber,City Secretary, 4B Member Jeff Springer,4B Member John
Payne, 4B Member Will Dutton, 4B Member Christy Crutsinger, Park
Board Member Lee Allison, Park Board Member Cora Harner, Park Board
Member Melanie Jacobs
OTHERS
PRESENT:Cheryl Price, Deputy City Secretary;Dennis Sims,Architect, Dunkin Sims,
Stoffels, Inc.
1.Call Meeting to Order.
Mayor Muir called the meeting to order at 6:00 p.m.
2.Review and Discuss the Comprehensive Parks Plan.
City Manager Brice was recognized for introduction and advised that Dennis Sims
is the Architect with Dunkin Sims, Stoffels, Inc.who has been working on the
Comprehensive Park Plan. He is here to present the Plan and will run the meeting.
He advised that tonight’s presentation is a result of suggestions and staff work over
the past several months. No action will be taken at tonight’s meeting, this is a
chance for the Council and Boards provide input.
Dennis Sims, Architect, Dunkin Sims, Stoffels, Inc. was recognized.He noted that all
they do is park and recreation planning for cities.He presented the Future Parks
Concept Plan on a powerpoint presentation for the following 4 parks and welcomed
all input and suggestions from the Council and Board members as each park was
presented.
SWITZER PARK
Mr. Sims noted that Switzer Park is the park where the current outdated city
swimming pool is located.The pool would be filled in and its area would be replaced
with a water feature -splash pad/spray ground area which requires no employee
staffing. The spray structure can be turned on and off at any hours the city may
choose.He noted that typically cities do not fence in these types of features.He
advised they were planning on demolition of the existing concession building. The
existing canopy will remain with some retro-fitting and possibly an additional
canopy over the existing playground.There will be additional landscaping and a 45
space parking lot.Below is a copy of the preliminary proposed rendering presented
at the meeting for Switzer Park:
Mr. Sims presented the “Opinion of Probable Cost”(below)of the Switzer Park
improvements and noted that these are only rough cost estimates.
The following suggestions, questions,and/or concerns were brought up by various
Council and Board Members regarding the proposed improvements to Switzer
Park:
The health safety of the water (e-coli) if the area was unsupervised.It was noted
that the water would not be reused and drains into the sewer. Mr. Sims advised that
a majority of these types of facilities are not typically supervised. Mike Brice
advised that the city would have workers monitor the park on a regular schedule.
There was concern on the hours of the park water features being open. It was noted
that the hours could be set when the water features would be available. Also, when
the water feature is activated it does not run constantly and is activated by a foot
controlled button by the users which turns on the water feature for 10 minutes at a
time. When no one is using the spray ground/splash area, there is no water running.
The feature area is basically a flat area with a small slope to drain.
With no fencing there was concern of children running into the roads and/or
parking area. It was noted that this is just concept and barriers could be included.
It was noted that the surface consists of non-slip textures.
It was noted that the original park was built with a grant from Texas Parks and
Wildlife. Once you are tied in with Texas Parks and Wildlife funding,the facilities
are locked in and anything taken out has to be replaced somewhere else and/or be of
similar use.Because it is a “like use” the replacement of the pool with the
splash/spray ground water feature would be an approved feature change.
Replacement or change of any of the park features (Basketball Court, Practice
Field,and Playground)that were included in the original grant cannot be removed
or changed without approval from Texas Parks and Wildlife.
The condition of the sidewalks was noted. Mr. Sims advised the sidewalks/trails
were not part of this plan. City Manager Brice advised that the sidewalk
improvement plan would take care of the issues of concern regarding the sidewalks.
It was noted that the type of canopy they would use is basically a large type of
umbrella;further discussion indicated the canopy has a lifespan of about 10 years
under normal conditions (excluding large hail, wind storms, vandalism, etc.)
7 ACRE NEIGHBORHOOD PARK
This park is proposed to be dedicated with Phase III of the Sable Creek Subdivision.
This park would be a neighborhood type park.The concept is that the size and the
uses would specifically serve the neighborhood.Included amenities would be a
multi-purpose court, a playground area with a pavilion,about 4000 L.F.of hike and
bike trails;and a pedestrian bridge to connect the trails into the subdivision.He
noted that some of the trails could be constructed of decomposed granite which is a
different surface, color texture than concrete and could be something unique to the
city.However, he did note that the park is located in a flood zone area and the
danger of a future flood could take that granite out.
Mr. Sims noted that there is no parking planned for this park. He advised that
typically in a neighborhood park there is no parking.The concept is that you walk
to a neighborhood park. If you start putting parking in the neighborhood parks it
might create precedence and all future neighborhood parks would want parking. It
was noted that the park at Quail Run does have parking and that it is rarely, if ever
used.
Below is a copy of the preliminary proposed rendering presented at the meeting for
the 7 Acre Neighborhood Park:
Mr. Sims presented the “Opinion of Probable Cost” (below) of the 7
Acre Neighborhood Park improvements and noted that these are only rough cost
estimates.
The following suggestions, questions,and/or concerns were brought up by various
Council and Board Members regarding the proposed improvements to the 7 Acre
Neighborhood Park:
Mr. Sims noted that typically in a neighborhood park there is no parking.The
concept is that you walk to a neighborhood park.If you start putting parking in the
neighborhood parks it might create precedence and all future neighborhood parks
would want parking.It was noted that the park at Quail Run does have parking
and that it is rarely, if ever used.
A suggestion was made to bring in trees native to the State of Texas in for
landscaping along the trails and have signs installed indicating the types of trees,
etc. for educational purposes.
There was concern as to how it would be policed/monitored if there was no parking.
It was noted that the park would be visible from the street. The police will be able to
see the whole park from the road. There could also be curfew/hours set for the park
so that there is no late night basketball games, etc.
There was some discussion about the medium mentioned for the trails (decomposed
granite) and concern for maintenance and upkeep of weeds etc.He noted it is five
inches deep and there is some maintenance.
The pedestrian bridge was mentioned and it was noted that the city owns a bridge
we could use. Mr. Sims advised that there are plans in one of the other parks to use
that bridge.
It was suggested to put the shade canopy over the playground. Mr. Sims noted
there is probably enough money to add a shade canopy over the playground.
NEW PARK LAND EAST OF 35
Mr. Sims noted this Park plan is for the new acreage the City owns east of 35 across
from the newly constructed Park and ball fields on the west side.
He advised that that the plan consists of the ball fields which were planned for
Railroad Park;but,full ball fields couldn’t be installed at Railroad for reasons he
would explain later. He noted the location of the fields on the rendering and the
reason they were located where they are is because of the flood plain area and the
floodway area. He noted the plan is for two Baseball fields at 225’ and four 175’
fields for softball, etc. He advised that this is long term planning, with probable
build-out of 50-60,000 residents you are probably looking at 10 to 12 fields to serve
the City. Also, the draw for tournaments in the area would be great with this
number of fields and their location.The floodway area can be used for practice
space and soccer fields because there are no structures involved.The pedestrian
bridge which the city owns will be used to cross over in the center over the low area,
from the Baseball fields to the practice and soccer fields. It was noted that the
bridge would be very visible in this location than in the previously presented
neighborhood park.The park is currently planned with 450 parking spaces which is
more than needed and can always be cut back. It could be built in phases, the first
phase could be the entry, and three fields and half of the park and phase II could be
the remaining three fields and the rest of the park. Mr. Sims noted that this park is
the most costly of all of the parks presented tonight.
Below is a copy of the preliminary proposed rendering presented at the meeting for
the New Park Land East of 35:
Mr. Sims presented the “Opinion of Probable Cost” (below) of the New Park Land
East of 35 improvements and noted that these are only rough cost estimates.
The following suggestions, questions, and/or concerns were brought up by various
Council and Board Members regarding the proposed improvements to the New
Park Land East of 35:
It was noted that it would be nice to see the younger children’s ball games at
Railroad. Mr. Sims advised that he does not recommend the expense of putting the
ballfields at Railroad because it was a landfill at one time and is unstable.
It was noted that a small storage building may be constructed on this side, but the
other filed would house the bigger equipment. It was noted that a pavilion could be
constructed in the center of the fields as is on the west side of 35. They are going to
have to work the location of the restrooms. It was noted they may be located north
of the fields at the concession.
It was noted the extra parking is a good idea because it could also be a feed for the
ballfields across the highway.
A question of access to the fields across the highway was brought up; and,if a
flyover would be constructed. Mike Brice advised when this project is done the
trails will be connected underneath the freeway instead of over which would provide
for a more extensive trail system.The trail system was brought up and Mr. Sims
advised that they were proposing some trails in the park plans. He suggested that
the City pursue a Trail Master Plan for the future so when development comes in
the City can make sure the plan for the trail system is included and constructed with
future new developments.A Trail Master Plan looks at access considering
thoroughfares, existing parks, creeks, hospitals, schools, etc. Mike Brice did note
that the current sidewalk plan does connect all of the parks.
An amphitheatre was suggested similar to the one in McKinney. Mr. Sims said the
idea of an amphitheatre has not been brought up, they have done several, it
wouldn’t have to be a Starplex, could be very simple, something they could look at
doing. It was noted that the city does not own the hill which was suggested, as far as
placement and seating for the amphitheater. It was noted the acoustics may not be
the best being adjacent to 35.
It was noted that Porter Park was complete and all of the ball fields have been
constructed there that could be.
Access was mentioned and it was noted there is currently already a path that is used
to get onto the property.
RAILROAD STREET PARK
Mr. Sims advised that they thought about a lot of uses for this park, but it is
restrictive because it is located on top of a landfill. We cannot penetrate or break
the landfill.He noted that you would have a hard time getting anyone to seal a
document to even put light poles on the property because it is not stable and you
don’t know what they are going into.This also would apply to construction. There
is an existing building there, but you would not be able to get an engineer to sign off
anything structural on the property. This really limits the project as to what can be
done on the landfill. This is the reason for moving the construction of the additional
Baseball fields to the 35 Park area. It was noted that practice space is always
needed. This Railroad Street Park would be a great facility for that.There will be
three practice fields and a planned dog park. The dog park will be divided into two
areas;one area would be designated for large dogs,and one area for small dogs,
with separate entrances. Amenities would include doggie fountains, doggie mitts,
signage, etc.He noted that dog parks usually become a very popular park and
people do drive from other areas to utilize them.He concluded that they will not
be doing much to the practice fields, that the improvements would mainly consist of
the dog park with fencing, expanding the parking lot (150 spaces) and improving to
a concrete access road.
Mr. Sims presented the “Opinion of Probable Cost” (below) of the Railroad Stree t
Park improvements and noted that these are only rough cost estimates.
The following suggestions, questions, and/or concerns were brought up by various
Council and Board Members regarding the proposed improvements to the Railroad
Street Park:
There were no issues brought up. There was brief discussion that it was a wise
choice not to spend the thousands of dollars required for new ballfields at Railroad
Street Park.It was noted the parking would be concrete.That this proposal may be
the best use for the Railroad Street Park.
Mr. Sims concluded his presentation by soliciting any additional input or questions.
There was a question as to whether there was anything considered for Duck Creek
Park. Mr. Sims advised that it was not considered.It was noted it was a very small
park located in flood plain area which the city inherited, near the lift station. It was
suggested that it would be a good location to put in a Frisbee Golf park. Mr. Sims
advised that a Frisbee Golf park in not an expensive park to install.
Mr. Sims was asked what the thought was on making parks out of areas in the city
where homes have been abandoned and/or deteriorated. Mr. Sims advised that the
City could create pocket parks with the properties; however,advised to be careful
not create too many because they become maintenance nightmares.He noted if they
were done specifically in the downtown urban area that they may work, but would
not advise making it a policy for the City.
It was noted that the handicapped have not been addressed and what would the cost
be to have a handicapped park –a playground specifically designed for
handicapped.Mr. Sims advised that specifically designed handicapped parks are
not that much more expensive than a normal park. He noted an example of a
standard $50,000 park –the same park designed specifically for handicapped would
run about $65,000-$70,000. He advised that every park area that they design has to
be ADA Accessible by Federal Law and this has been a requirement for a long time.
There being no further input or questions Mr. Sims thanked everyone for their
input and advised that he was going to take all of the information he received
tonight back to the office and revise the plans and would and bring the information
back with revisions.
Mayor Muir thanked Mr. Sims and advised the Council and Boardmembers that if
they come up with any additional suggestions to forward the information to the City
Manager, Mike Brice to provide to Mr. Sims.
3.Adjourn.
Mayor Muir adjourned the meeting at 6:55 p.m.